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Cezi wrote:

Heathen wrote:What year the slimlines are REALLY from? 1985 ?

Yes I would say so. Although the dates on the CD's vary from 1982 to 1985 but these are probably dates of first LP releases. Maybe some of the disks were released in 1984 but 1985 id definitely the deadline.

Cezi

Source(s)?

MetalDelight wrote: Source(s)?

Well, I have most of them. Besides it's a series with catalogue inside. As there is no any album released after 1985 (e.gSlayer's Hell Awaits was released in 1985), there is balance of probability that the series was released in 1985. If it was released earlier it couldn't contain Hell Awaits in the catalogue. Simple logic!

Cezi

I wonder why record companies and/or pressingplants aren't that smart.

what are you getting at, MetalDelight?

What he says makes perfect sense and is based on facts.

Heathen wrote:what are you getting at, MetalDelight?

Exactly what I'm saying, nothing more, nothing less. Simple logic.

Yakish wrote:Yes, this is perfect bootleg replica of all times. I never seen such a ideally imitation of P+O Pallas "pixel" font. BUT(T):
1. Fact. Pallas started to press CDs in 1987 (Matrix of this boot says 09-86 = September of 1986)
2. "Made In Germany" on CD face. It must be written "Made in W.Germany" in 1986
3. I don't know any other CD pressed on Pallas by Roadrunner label. AFAIK they never used this plant. RR used CTA in Japan (real slimlines from 1984-1985), then Polygram, Hanover (only a few very rare CDs in 1986) and since late 1986-1987 usual Sonopress.
4. My Sinner "Dangerous Charm" http://www.discogs.com/Sinner-Dangerous ... se/4397243 among the very earliest releases pressed by this plant in 1987 has 0626-A in matrix code, but this metallica boot has 1029-A (have to be 1988?).
This CD has many small mistakes, but if you don't know all this specific details it may looks like real thing, but of course it's not!
Unfortunately somebody removed P+O Pallas page from Discogs few days ago and i can't check other releases. I think bootleggers stole this code 1029-A from matrix of another release and invented other details to made it looks "naturally"
Also it was printed (interesting in which quantities?) on official pressing plant somewhere. Another similar examples: Sentenced "Shadows.." with wrong matrix which looks so professional that many old collectors still believe this is real first press, Hades "Resisting Success", Burzum "Det Som Engang Var" (TSD EYE01 in matrix) and many others.

Hello!

I tried to quote old Yakish post from Collector Porn 2013 about German slimline releases to Roadrunner Slimlines thread, and I'll try to put my opinion about it.

First of all about 15 years ago I saw on ebay and I can confirm M80 - Maniac's Revenge Roadrunner CD. It was in ordinary jewel case without back sticker, as the original one was destroyed as the seller had explained. It didn't have the insert either. So I can't confirm the existence of slimline version, but I do confirm existence of the CD and I do remember the disc had had layout similar to slimlines rather than to jewel case versions , comparing e.g. to Metallica. I wasn't collecting slimlines at that time, but it was sold definitely for less than 100 US. The seller was from Germany, but I didn't write down either seller or buyer ID at that time.

Secondly in my personal opinion all German slimlines are originals. If they were fake they wouldn't have been so extremaly rare. Please note that Metallica's slimline version and jewel case version have completely different discs inside. As I wrote before in this thread, I heard the rumour that all German releases were pressed in so bad quality that Roadrunner decided to withdraw and destroy all copies before putting them into market. I don't believe the rumour that 500 copies were made of each. They wouldn't be so rare then. If somebody listened to any German slimline, his/her brief review would be appreciated. Perhaps for example CD skips without noticeable scratches or is faulty by some other feature. Anyway I'm just speculating at this point about possible withdrawal.

The fact that there is "Made in Germany" instead of "Made in West Germany", is no by any means any indication towards being counterfeit. If you check other releases from that time you could see that in many cases it's written simply Germany, even on Japanese slimlines on back sticker you can see Germany. Here is the link to second Roadrunner MF Melissa release:
http://www.subirimagenes.com/otros-meli ... 14068.html

Finally and the most important thing, if you know anyone who's got access to ebay archive, I could share ebay auctions numbers where Manowar - Hail To England, and Jaguar - This Time had been listed. Maybe it would be possible to extract the photos of the CD's in the auction description, which were very detailed as far as I remember. I have the seller's ID, but they didn't reply to my inquiries. Unfortunately I wasn't foreseeing enough to download and archive the pictures at that time.

Twisted Sister - Under The Blade slimline CD does exist. It's Japanese release not German but oddly almost all release was put into ordinary jewel case. However I saw perfect slimline version about seven years ago, but I was outbid. It was sold for 516 USD. It's definitely rarest slimline except those four "German" ones.

Roadrunner's Mad Max - Rollin' Thunder also exists in jewel case version. It was release circa 1985/1986 in Germany - and I don't mean common Roadrunner boot released later. If I come across a photo of that one I could compare it to other P+O Pallas releases.

Since slimline Cd's are kind of my obsession, any further discussion is gladly awaited:))

Cezi

P.S. If admin could possibly move the posts concerning Slimlines from Collector Porn 2013 (bottom of page 10 and almost all page 11) into this thread it would be great. There are some other posts worth mentioning, and I couldn't quote them all by myself.

Cezi

Hi Cezi! ok, let's try to discuss some moments again patiently and probably we'll see the light at the end of tunnel.
First. I didn't try to prove that writing "Made in Germany" instead of "Made in West Germany" necessarily means counterfeit. Of course no. But if we speak about authentic CD press from 1986 it simply does not follow any logic. Anyway your example with MF "Melissa" CD which been pressed in 1988 already had "Made In Germany" writing at the same time when other german labels (for example Scratch, Noise, Steamhammer etc.) still wrote "Made In West-Germany" until 1990
Second. And most important. Metallica "Kill'em All" CD has inexistent matrix code. This should be release from 1988. Also bootleggers printed Roadrunner logo on CD face from 1988 era as on your MF example. In 1986-1987 Roadrunner used another logo (each letter in separate red foursquare. "Roadrunner" word written by semicircle at the top of CD) Examples: King Diamond "Abigail", Crimson Glory "Crimson Glory" etc. This recent Metallica auction is a one big fake. Fortunately people wrote him letter about it and he decided to close it with those funny start price.

I am sure all stories and rumors about other "lost" ultra-mega-rare Manowar, Jaguar and M-80 CDs it's just a myth. We've seen many really ultra rare and strictly limited private pressings last few years, but not a single copy of releases mentioned above.
Also fake bootleg cd does not imply it's an easy to find thing. Old russian bootlegs of Stormwitch "Stronger Than Heaven" and "Tales Of Terror" for example are VERY hard to find. I remember people paid insane amounts many years ago for this crap. Bootleg mania wasn't so well-known and popular deal as now back in early 2000's so poor bidders bought paid insane amounts for counterfeits.
And the last. Mad Max "Rollin' Thunder" regular jewel case version.
Once i asked some questions to german seller with huge catalogue about this CD.
I needed scans as confirmation of authencity. How i was surprised when i received scans of: original CD from slimline, original front cover from slimline and something (i can't name it back cover) presumably intended as back cover:


This is another strange release, but definitely doesn't look like normal to me. In this case looks like someone has lost or broke plastic flip case from slim line version and tried to make something similar to usual back cover for regular jewel case

Well... they certaintly are nice... i love them

i have four myself.

Anvil - Metal on metal
Anvil - Forged in fire
Mercyful fate - Dont Break the oath (signed)
Venom - At war with satan


i would like to buy the rest also.. so if any of you have any for sale.. let me know

You seem quite optimist that's the spirit

If any of You are interested I have for sale/trade Tokyo Blade - Night Of The Blade (slimline CD). Both disc (small signs of use) and insert are in very good condition, however one hinge of the case is broken. I guess 35 Euro is a reasonable price.

BTW, I love the slimlines and I am lucky to own them almost all in MINT condition, except are the myths written here above like Metallica, M80, Jaguar, Twisted Sister..

oldskoolcollector wrote:BTW, I love the slimlines and I am lucky to own them almost all in MINT condition, except are the myths written here above like Metallica, M80, Jaguar, Twisted Sister..

Do you have Manowar?

Heathen wrote:What year the slimlines are REALLY from? 1985 ?

Yes.

There's so much nonsense in this thread from the last year before the forum went down...

I believe I found something interesting on the Metallica slimline version that you guys were looking for they different then you all are describing it they don't fake at least to me somebody who knows this stuff can figure it out though.

Slimline
https://web.archive.org/web/20090728173 ... l/007.html

Jewel case
https://web.archive.org/web/20090728173 ... l/006.html