Is Metal Music Spiritual?

King Zombie · Post by **King Zombie** » Sat Jun 27, 2009 12:00 pm

Helm wrote:My sense of humour doesn't feed on human flesh.

GREAT QUOTE!

Spiritual healing how can metal not be spiritual? lol

Helm · Post by **Helm** » Sat Jun 27, 2009 4:14 pm

Okay, so you've finally come upfront and just plain said "I do not think Metal is spiritual" without rambling on for four pages with no clear outcome. That's pretty much all that was needed. I don’t view Metal message boards for the sake of reading about how Heavy Metal has deeply and emotionally affected the outcome of your existence.

Actually, aside from everything, I'd like to hear from DaN on what the purpose of the Corroseum forum is, at this juncture, and if it includes serious conversation on Heavy Metal in its premises or not. Avenger, you are a moderator on these boards and the moderation's responsibility is often to set the tone and that's what you seem to be doing in your replies to me. I get the signal loud and clear: internet comedy, one-liners and let's make fun of how Heavy Metal has tried to achieve an intellectual face. So if it is indeed the case that DaN and his mod squad do not want 4 page ramblings on whether Heavy Metal has intrinsic aesthetic and philosophical interest, then I'll happily be on my way (as these things are what I'm mostly interested in discussing). I try not to antagonize the climate on the message boards I visit and I mostly enjoy the Corroseum because it seems to allow for those sorts of things also and is pretty laid back (in fact I think it's the forum on which I've been insulted less, and oh, does the internet likes to insult me). I usually attribute it to the average age of the posters here being close to thirty. So if it's alright to talk about other things besides showing each other pictures of CDs to check matrixes or what-are-we-listening-to-now I'd like to know.

If so, is discouraging a serious talk and belittling the talkers what you should be doing as a moderator? I may have found your attitude to be pretty disagreeable in the past but it never really mattered as far as I could ignore you like any other user, but now you're a fixture to the forum officially and your opinion has a different weight.

Post by **DaN** » Sat Jun 27, 2009 5:50 pm

Helm wrote:
Okay, so you've finally come upfront and just plain said "I do not think Metal is spiritual" without rambling on for four pages with no clear outcome. That's pretty much all that was needed. I don’t view Metal message boards for the sake of reading about how Heavy Metal has deeply and emotionally affected the outcome of your existence.
Actually, aside from everything, I'd like to hear from DaN on what the purpose of the Corroseum forum is, at this juncture, and if it includes serious conversation on Heavy Metal in its premises or not.

I definitely want it to be a place for these kind of issues, yes. I wish I had more time to dive into these discussions, but I try to follow them as good as I can. It's not always that I feel I have that much to add before someone else put it better than I ever could though..

Avenger, you are a moderator on these boards and the moderation's responsibility is often to set the tone and that's what you seem to be doing in your replies to me. I get the signal loud and clear: internet comedy, one-liners and let's make fun of how Heavy Metal has tried to achieve an intellectual face. So if it is indeed the case that DaN and his mod squad do not want 4 page ramblings on whether Heavy Metal has intrinsic aesthetic and philosophical interest, then I'll happily be on my way (as these things are what I'm mostly interested in discussing). I try not to antagonize the climate on the message boards I visit and I mostly enjoy the Corroseum because it seems to allow for those sorts of things also and is pretty laid back

You pinpointed it pretty well there, an it is a very difficult middle-way - to have a forum that's both laid-back and at the same time doesn't sway from deep discussions on this most important thing in our lives. Imo you can have "internet humor" and one-liners in the same thread as 4-paragraph essays without anyone needing to feel overtly offended.

So if it's alright to talk about other things besides showing each other pictures of CDs to check matrixes or what-are-we-listening-to-now I'd like to know.

It is alright. After all CDs are gay sextoys for n00bs, didn't you know?
SEE?! I made a joke in a serious thread! And the database still hasen't collapsed!

There's probably more to be added on this subject, but it's both off-topic for the thread, and I'm a bit too "unfocused" at the moment to give a proper reply.
TBA

Post by **DaN** » Sat Jun 27, 2009 6:13 pm

Helm wrote:If so, is discouraging a serious talk and belittling the talkers what you should be doing as a moderator? I may have found your attitude to be pretty disagreeable in the past but it never really mattered as far as I could ignore you like any other user, but now you're a fixture to the forum officially and your opinion has a different weight.

Better address this matter too, even if it's still a bit off-topic:
The mods were chosen mainly on the behalf of 2 factors: Activity on the forum and not being too flakey. When posting, their opinions doesn't need to be taken more seriously than anyone elses. After all they must be allowed to their own opinion and character. Moderating is purely a technical and as with most forums, when they post with the "mod-hat" on, this is clearly stated.

It's not against the rules to be a smartass. Being an asshole is, but I don't think even Avenger qualify for that

Helm · Post by **Helm** » Sat Jun 27, 2009 9:34 pm

Thanks for the clarifications.

I don't mind humour generally, I'd go so far as to say that my emotion chip is learning to generate it also sometimes... It's when frivolity becomes an easy excuse for presumption and insult that I have more trouble stomaching it. An ass, be it smart or otherwise, always comes with the eventual asshole.

Anyway, burying the hatchet, I don't come to the internet to fight with anyone.

nightsblood · Post by **nightsblood** » Sat Jun 27, 2009 10:22 pm

(we now return you to your regularly scheduled thread, already in progress....

)

As noted by others, 'Spiritual' is a loaded word that many folks will shy away from or mock as a knee-jerk reaction. I'm not gonna try to define it here.

While Avenger made a good point in that Metal does not mean the same thing to all people, it's also worth reminding everyone that DIFFERENT Metal means different things to any one person. For example, load up a Stormwarrior CD and i'll be happily air-guitaring absent-mindedly all over the house. Catch me in a bad mood and put on some Limbonic Art and the music and my mood will antagonize one another- the world seems darker but i also move through that blackened mood faster with the right soundtrack playing. Put on the right album by Fates Warning, Anathema, or Savatage, and I'll sit and ponder my life through the lens of the music with the lights out (" 'cause in the dark, it's easier to see"..... sorry, couldn't resist).

I think this hints at why metal has been reasonably successful at bridging the generation gap and staying with many people past their impressionable teenage years- it covers all emotional walks of life, from "crush kill destroy" to "awaken the guardian".

Last note- regarding the 'metal lifestyle', if some folks wanna wear Motorhead t-shirts and bullet belts every day of their life that's fine, but don't think that it somehow makes you a greater fan or proves you're more into the music than someone with short hair and slacks. At that point you're no better than a religious devotee who thinks they're closer to God because they put a bigger check in the collection plate.

Avenger · Post by **Avenger** » Sun Jun 28, 2009 1:50 am

Helm wrote:
Okay, so you've finally come upfront and just plain said "I do not think Metal is spiritual" without rambling on for four pages with no clear outcome. That's pretty much all that was needed. I don’t view Metal message boards for the sake of reading about how Heavy Metal has deeply and emotionally affected the outcome of your existence.
Actually, aside from everything, I'd like to hear from DaN on what the purpose of the Corroseum forum is, at this juncture, and if it includes serious conversation on Heavy Metal in its premises or not. Avenger, you are a moderator on these boards and the moderation's responsibility is often to set the tone and that's what you seem to be doing in your replies to me. I get the signal loud and clear: internet comedy, one-liners and let's make fun of how Heavy Metal has tried to achieve an intellectual face. So if it is indeed the case that DaN and his mod squad do not want 4 page ramblings on whether Heavy Metal has intrinsic aesthetic and philosophical interest, then I'll happily be on my way (as these things are what I'm mostly interested in discussing). I try not to antagonize the climate on the message boards I visit and I mostly enjoy the Corroseum because it seems to allow for those sorts of things also and is pretty laid back (in fact I think it's the forum on which I've been insulted less, and oh, does the internet likes to insult me). I usually attribute it to the average age of the posters here being close to thirty. So if it's alright to talk about other things besides showing each other pictures of CDs to check matrixes or what-are-we-listening-to-now I'd like to know.

If so, is discouraging a serious talk and belittling the talkers what you should be doing as a moderator? I may have found your attitude to be pretty disagreeable in the past but it never really mattered as far as I could ignore you like any other user, but now you're a fixture to the forum officially and your opinion has a different weight.

Just to make things clear, my opinion on certain topics and that of Dan's or what the Corroseum message boards are intended for or not are all totally different things. My position as a mod is not to be a golden boy, agree with what everyone has to say and stand around in the background as a troll but rather to make sure that the forum runs smoothly in regards to the posted rules. Disagreeing with your point of view and how you go about expressing it is irrelevant. To be honest, I shouldn't even really be taking the time to explain this to you but...

The reason I use the Corroseum:

#1. Collecting purposes
#2. To discuss bands
#3. Learn more about the aforementioned

That does not mean that everybody is the same and uses this place for the same reasons but at the same time everybody needs to tolerate each other so that the boards function smoothly. So go a head and do as you please. I'm certainly not going to speak on behalf of everybody, but don't expect me not to criticize what I don't agree with, as I'm doing that solely in a manner that represents only myself.

Helm · Post by **Helm** » Sun Jun 28, 2009 9:53 am

Yeah sure, go ahead and criticize.

Sgt. Kuntz · Post by **Sgt. Kuntz** » Sun Jun 28, 2009 4:02 pm

Back to topic:
Is Metal spiritual? Hell, no. But it is a lot of other things, it gives us a platform to do things, or at least to think about doing things, that are verboten in the normal every day life.

What i mean is, you can leave your post-modern, logic, gentle, politically correct, irenic and sometimes even feminine world behind and dive into a archaic, mostly men-dominated fantasy world, beyond the daily grind. You can be a strong, freelance individualist, overcoming any challenge, or you can be part of a giant collective, like a warrior doing battle stuff, or a metalhead fighting for the real deal, or be the greates sex machine on earth, be what ever you want.

Listen to the music, read the lyrics, look at the cover and just feel yourself lifted up by it. And that even hightented when you go to a concert.

I don't say that that counts for every one of us, but it maybe explains some of our passion for heavy metal.

So, that was my little excursion into metal-philosophy, at least the best way i could express it in English anyway, thanks for listening!

The Knell · Post by **The Knell** » Sun Jun 28, 2009 5:07 pm

I'm not into the idea of becoming some fantasy character in my mind but heavy metal as a way to detach from the daily grind is something I can associate with. Maybe similar but more passive. More like lookit that badass warrior on the snow summit fighting an ice bear or something, wow. great show.
I dont know

MEXDefenderOfSteel · Post by **MEXDefenderOfSteel** » Sun Jun 28, 2009 5:14 pm

nightsblood wrote: Last note- regarding the 'metal lifestyle', if some folks wanna wear Motorhead t-shirts and bullet belts every day of their life that's fine, but don't think that it somehow makes you a greater fan or proves you're more into the music than someone with short hair and slacks. At that point you're no better than a religious devotee who thinks they're closer to God because they put a bigger check in the collection plate.

totally agreed, im the kind of person that one day dresses up, bullet belt,studs leather etc etc....and the next day i can look just as regular and as normal that hardly anyone would notice im into HM, and thats cool, cause i dont have to impress anyone, but me, its more like my lifestyle and HM, not "metal lifestyle"...

daniel · Post by **daniel** » Mon Jun 29, 2009 9:20 am

How the fuck is this world 'feminine´?

I don't listen to metal to pretend I'm some sex machine or indulge in any other macho bullshit, If it sets aflame my sense of adventure it has nothing to do with that. If metal makes me look at life in a different way; detaches me to a degree, lifts me up, affects my thoughts, affects my ideals; enhances me as a person then I damn well consider it spiritual - I can't believe the general attitude of inherently linking any sort spiritual inclination with being a thoroughly religious person - it's insulting, and since you don't seem to know very much about the subject you might just have to accept that not everyone shares your definition of spirituality. And while the matter is scoffed at it could be said you are laughing at the feeling of many of the musicians who's music you listen to.

Sgt. Kuntz · Post by **Sgt. Kuntz** » Mon Jun 29, 2009 10:14 am

daniel wrote:How the fuck is this world 'feminine´?

It is, when you compare it with the content of most metal songs

!

Avenger · Post by **Avenger** » Mon Jun 29, 2009 3:39 pm

daniel wrote:How the fuck is this world 'feminine´?

I don't listen to metal to pretend I'm some sex machine or indulge in any other macho bullshit, If it sets aflame my sense of adventure it has nothing to do with that. If metal makes me look at life in a different way; detaches me to a degree, lifts me up, affects my thoughts, affects my ideals; enhances me as a person then I damn well consider it spiritual - I can't believe the general attitude of inherently linking any sort spiritual inclination with being a thoroughly religious person - it's insulting, and since you don't seem to know very much about the subject you might just have to accept that not everyone shares your definition of spirituality. And while the matter is scoffed at it could be said you are laughing at the feeling of many of the musicians who's music you listen to.

See thread in "Land Of Mystery".