The Corroseum forum (new design under construction)

"Axe crazy" by Jaguar 1982.

J.K. wrote:I'm agree with the statement of LehtylSteel.

Thrash mean a Punk side... anyway I don't even want to start thinking of what proto-thrash could be, but instinctively I would skip Sabbath, BOC or Accept, or proto-speed/speed stuffs.

Agreed! There's an early HC record (1981) called "New York Thrash"...Thrash definitely came from HC/Punk scene. For proto-Thrash you need to search in the early HC scene.

Great intriguing topic and I totally agree with OP's selection. "Symptom Of The Universe" was the quintessential proto-Thrash embryo. Fact. No need for discussion there ...but let's keep namedropping obscure faves from the 1981-83 era of proto-Speed/Thrash and don't get so bloody hung up about the distinctions there - noone gave a crap back then anyways...


3 faves from the year of 1981:

DEATH SS - Murder Angels
GOTHAM CITY - Midnight Hunter
HOLOCAUST - The Small Hours

Just because ONE riff in Symptom this is proto thrash... argh. So the eponym song by Black Sab must be proto-black metal, proto-doom metal, proto-death metal, proto-sludge metal... this means nothing in the end, imo.

Lethyl: Didn't know about this compilation, very interesting indeed. And yep, Thrash needs Punk unless it's just some 70's heavy rock

Budgie - Breadfan
Scorpions - He's A Woman, She's A Man
Legend - Why Don't You Kill Me?

Maybe we should give a definition for Thrash Metal before.

SATAN - Oppression

never heard a pre-Thrash song with a more thrashier riff than this!

J.K. wrote:Maybe we should give a definition for Thrash Metal before.

As an oldie I'd like to keep it wide, after all we're talking about influences here, not some fixed genre defining formula - i.e. sometimes faster, sometimes heavier or chunkier riffs, vocally harsher, less focus on melody, more on rhythm etc. As introduced and popularized by the likes of Metallica, Exodus, Destruction, Celtic Frost, Bathory, Slayer, Testament, Sodom, Kreator, Razor and even Voivod. Am I too mainstream?

Edit: Of course stating some examples where you later can hear one particular feature could help to clear things up...

"Sabre Dance".
"Knees Up Mother Brown".

I consider all songs on Kill 'Em All the ultimate proto- or pre-thrash songs.

"I consider all songs on Kill 'Em All the ultimate proto- or pre-thrash songs.".....
********************************************
Excellent point like most of the heavy metal maniacs my introduction to heavier heavy metal was back in October of 1982, so I got to know bands like Raven, Riot, Anvil, Jaguar, Exciter, Venom + tons of coverage in Kick Ass Monthly, of a who is who in real actual metal....and a shit load of punk rock albums... before Kill em All was released in my area (Las Vegas, Nevada) in August 1983....

I was wondering if Metallica's "Kill em All" is considered the real first out and out thrash metal album or was the real first one Slayer " Show No Mercy " which happened around Christmas time, in December 1983.

I was just wondering since, I was using the term POWER METAL, before some-one coined the thrash metal term.

Oh yeah....I have to say excellent topic, and will try to make my own proto-thrash metal cassette, based on the knowledge presented here in this topic, excellent info's !!!!!!

Wait, if you consider all "Kill em all" songs Thrash Metal, what is Speed Metal then?
As a first Proto-Thrash output I'd still consider Venom's "Black Metal" although played in a sloppy way, but this is the first I could imagine that deserves to use the term Proto-Thrash. All the others mentioned here are Proto-Power/Speed Metal. Sorry guys...
Mythra is one of them as well.

Good point LethylSteel.... especially when Venom influnced f.ex. Metallica a lot.